Ep 3 Crown of Midnight: Ch. 15 – 21

[00:00:21] James: Hello, and welcome back to Books, Cats, and Chaos, the podcast where we explore epic tales, sprinkle in a bit of humor, and embrace the chaos of book loving, cat herding, and everything in between. My name is James.

[00:00:42] Ka-Ce: And I’m Ka-Ce, and joining us right now is our youngest son, Fynn. If you are listening in on the podcast, our youngest little tabby here is wanting to be held by James. If you’re YouTube, you can see he’s about five months old, and he’s rambunctious. But we are a husband and wife team who love all things books, cats, brews, and the fun chaos in between. As you can clearly see.

[00:01:17] James: We are continuing our deep dive into Crown of Midnight in the Throne of Glass series. This is book two. Just as a reminder, if you are joining us again, or if you are new to our podcast, we are visiting the world of Throne of Glass by Sarah J. Maas. It is my time reading my time. It is my first time reading through this entire series.

[00:01:43] And so we are doing this in a spoiler free format. I say spoiler free. We’re not talking about anything past the chapters we’re talking about, but if. If you’re listening, then obviously there are spoilers in the chapters we’re talking about, [00:02:00] so. We are, however, not talking about anything else, so no ACOTAR and no Crescent City.

[00:02:09] Anything. And definitely nothing past Crown of Midnight. Yeah, no spoilers, everybody.

[00:02:22] Ka-Ce: As a content reminder, this podcast is for adult audiences only, as we will be using adult language to discuss adult topics and content and themes and more. So if you have tiny little ones running around, please save this podcast for later. And also if you are new here, our format is pretty simple. We do a recap of the chapter before going into our thoughts, theories, and predictions of what’s to come.

[00:02:47] And then we repeat the process for the next set of chapters that we are doing.

[00:02:54] James: We like to talk about all the stuff that’s going on, and the things that are annoying us about the characters. and the dumb decisions they make. is she really the world’s greatest assassin? Because, hmm, girl?

[00:03:09] Ka-Ce: and she’s a little rusty.

[00:03:11] James: She been rusty. Anyway, if you haven’t already and you like what you hear so far, please rate us. Subscribe to us. Comment on our podcast. Or on a social media channel. We would love to hear from you.

[00:03:34] Ka-Ce: Yes, yes we would. With that said, let’s head right on into chapter 15. Celaena sat in the back of the Great Hall with Chaol and several of his closest guards and the lesser nobility, all in an effort to see Rena Goldsmith perform for Prince Hollin’s return. And it was nice to see Chaol relaxed and teasing with his guards.

[00:03:55] Rena played the harp, entrancing everyone with her voice, accompanied by a violinist. [00:04:00] For her last song, Rena dedicated it to the royal family. The song was an ancient legend, an old poem, that Celaena hadn’t heard since her childhood, and she had never heard it set to music. The song spoke of a Fae woman blessed with profound power.

[00:04:16] Kings and lords sought her out, even though they feared her. Celaena thought it was a very bold choice, especially to dedicate it to the royal family. She also noted that the king didn’t react to the song. No, he just stared blankly at Rena. Celaena didn’t know when she had started crying, but she did. Chaol found her hand under the table and held it, giving her strength and support.

[00:04:39] They looked at each other and smiled. Hollin was bored and thought the performance was stupid. Dorian noticed Chaol and Celaena staring and smiling at each other, noting that she never once looked at him like that. Taking a deep breath, Dorian let Celaena go. Hours later, the King of Adarlan, Perrington, and Roland stood in the dungeon.

[00:05:00] Rena was shoved to her knees before them. She hadn’t put up a fight when the King’s guards captured her and the violinist. She hadn’t screamed when they beheaded the violinist. The king told her it is punishable by death to speak of or to encourage magic. It is an affront to the gods. Rena recited the names of the ones that the king had killed.

[00:05:21] Her daughter, her sister, her neighbors. She continued reciting her list of names as the axe fell. So, short but impactful chapter here. And it seems it took no time for the king and Perrington to rope Roland into whatever plans that they have. Uh, I wonder how far or how deep Roland is in with them at this point.

[00:05:52] James: Yeah, for, for Roland, I, I just still feel like, um, he was never meant to be a [00:06:00] co-conspirator. I’ve always seen him as a tool that, to be used.

[00:06:07] Ka-Ce: Like Cain?

[00:06:08] James: Yeah, um, cause even though he is the royal family, it, I don’t feel like that really matters. They’re just people to, to use to the benefit of, you know, whatever it is that they’re doing.

[00:06:22] Ka-Ce: hmm.

[00:06:23] James: Um, oh, okay. Um,

[00:06:28] Ka-Ce: Awww, hi Fynn

[00:06:33] James: yeah, I, I feel like, um, he was brought in and not given, Not given a choice, uh, Actually, I know what it reminds me of is that meme of, um, The Rock with, um, Chris Hart, and he’s like, Are you in or are you out? And Chris Hart’s like, well, what do you mean? And he’s like, just, are you in or are you out? And he’s like, well, I don’t know what you’re talking about, I’m out.

[00:06:55] And he’s like, well, no, you’re in. Um, That’s what it reminds me of, like, Roland I feel like, I feel like Roland’s not smart enough to deal with whatever they’re dealing with. he could be like, I don’t want to be part of this. And it’s like, well, no.

[00:07:13] Ka-Ce: You are.

[00:07:14] James: You are.

[00:07:16] Ka-Ce: I see I get the opposite. I feel like Roland is more like, Oh, the king is extending me an opportunity to be part of his council. Oh, and now he’s letting me in, you know, with, like, him and Perrington. I’m being embraced into the fold, and he’s going to take advantage of that as much as he can, because he wants to be close to the king.

[00:07:42] You know, because he was in some small little Port City, like, that didn’t really have a whole lot of influence, so this was his, you know, big chance to level himself up. Um, I don’t think he is as smart and as [00:08:00] conniving as, like, Perrington is. so he is still a tool to be used, like Cain. But

[00:08:10] James: Yea, that’s, um, I figure is. I think that he thinks he wants to be a part of this, um, until he really finds out what being part of this is. And then it’s like, oh, wait.

[00:08:24] Ka-Ce: Oh, too little, too late

[00:08:26] James: But then it’s too late and he’s not going to have a choice, like,

[00:08:32] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:08:34] James: Um, yeah, uh, I will say I hated this chapter.

[00:08:40] Ka-Ce: Please expand more.

[00:08:42] James: I was really bothered about the killing of the musician. Like, I,

[00:08:47] Ka-Ce: As one should be.

[00:08:48] James: I understood the, um, The statement that she was making, and you get the idea that she knew exactly where this was leading, and the violinist knew exactly where this was going. You know, this was going to be a final performance. Uh. But I still didn’t like it. It was still just

[00:09:12] Ka-Ce: Hard to read. Hard to swallow.

[00:09:14] James: Yeah.

[00:09:15] Ka-Ce: It’s funny that this comes up at the time politically where we stand in America. Uh, you know, with The army corps choir having to sing, you know, in front of the president and in front of all these governors and everything and the choice of songs that they sung and the way they spread out was just bravo to them. And I love seeing all the videos and stuff.

[00:09:52] James: Yeah.

[00:09:52] Ka-Ce: But it also, I, I was thinking about this and about another scene that comes later. Um, [00:10:00] and I fear for their safety. For exactly, like, this sort of reason, you know? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:10:09] James: Well, you know, whenever you have people who are in a position of power, and you have people speaking out against that, it’s always a risk that, you know, are you willing to take that risk? And, it can be a very real threat for a lot of people. Um,

[00:10:31] Ka-Ce: Especially the, the people in the audience that knew exactly what was referencing, the Les Mis song. Um, and you have other people that were like, Oh, we’re part of that revolution. And it’s like, oh no, honey. It just flew right over your head. What was, everything that was happening and what they were singing about.

[00:10:55] But yeah, just to see parallels in a fantasy world. Being mirrored in our own world right now is just kind of, sometimes a little too on the nose, but.

[00:11:08] James: That’s, uh, you know, all of the, all of the best stories, uh, are mere, you know, parallels to things in our world, um, you know, corrupt governments, tyrannical leadership, and shadow dealings with corrupt, you know, foreign.

[00:11:35] Ka-Ce: Mm hmm.

[00:11:36] James: You know, whatever, it’s, when you really break down a lot of, of, of stories, um,

[00:11:51] when you break down a lot of those stories, you really start to see the, the parallels between them.

[00:11:58] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:11:59] James: Fynn. [00:12:00] Sir.

[00:12:03] Ka-Ce: Can you give us a meow, Fynn? For our listeners, he is currently sniffing James mic.

[00:12:11] James: I, you might hear the purr. No? Okay. Um, so, yeah. Um, chapter 16. What started as a nice catch up breakfast with Celaena and Nehemia quickly turns sour. Nehemia wants Celaena to do more as the king’s champion to stop thinking of only herself and her freedom. Uh, Nehemia tells her that with each kill she is finding fewer and fewer excuses for remaining her friend.

[00:12:56] (sigh)

[00:12:59] Celaena is legitimately upset and finally confides in Nehemia that she hasn’t actually killed anyone. Nehemia is surprised and worried, telling her that if the king finds out that he will kill her. Um, but then Nehemia also asks about Archer Finn, seeming a bit nervous. When Celaena told Nehemia what happened, with Davis, Nehemia visibly pales.

[00:13:27] She tells Nehemia about Elena before showing her the secret tunnel. Celaena recounts everything between her, between her and Elena. she shows her the room where Cain summoned the Ridderak and even introduces her to Mort. While Nehemia examined the Wyrdmarks in the Tomb Room, Celaena realizes that the stars on the floor were actually constellations, and the stag, Lord of the North, the symbol of Terrasen, seems to be staring [00:14:00] up at something, which looks like an eye, and there’s a hole in the eye.

[00:14:05] The other eye was completely sealed within the Wyrdmark face, but this eye held a hollowed out iris. The riddle came back to Celaena. It is only with the eye that one can see rightly. Surely this is not a coincidence.

[00:14:23] The Wyrdmark only formed a face when standing on the stag. Otherwise, it seemed to disappear.

[00:14:29] Celaena looked into the hole and found a wall, but couldn’t see anything else. And Mort, of course, is not helpful.

[00:14:37] Nehemia agrees to teach Celaena more about the Wyrdmarks. Nehemia also dismisses Celaena’s thoughts on why Davis has a book on the Wyrdmarks. Celaena starts to think that maybe the eye of Elena and the riddle of the eye in the tomb might be connected, but Nehemia also dismisses that.

[00:15:01] Archer has a letter delivered to Celaena naming names of people associated with Davis, so Celaena heads to the city to trail them. When she returns, she finds a note from Chaol letting her know that the king wants her on guard duty at the ball the following night.

[00:15:22] Dun, dun, dun. And my initial thought on this is, Nehemia is being a terrible friend.

[00:15:32] Ka-Ce: Yes! Oh my gosh. I’m glad you agree. Because I really did not like, I did not like this scene.

[00:15:42] James: I don’t So, we have, you know, discussed at length this thing where Nehemia is legitimately concerned for her people and the fact that she can’t do anything because the king won’t [00:16:00] even talk to her. He’s He’s made it so that she has to talk to, um,

[00:16:05] Ka-Ce: Roland.

[00:16:07] James: you know, and that’s not gonna get her, you know, anywhere.

[00:16:12] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:16:18] James: Um, And, despite everything that Celaena is going through, She’s still, it’s like every time they meet, She’s pushing her and she’s like, you need to do more. You need to do more. You’re the champion. You need to do more. And Celaena’s like, yo, I’m the champion. I have to do exactly what the king says. Okay, exactly what the king says.

[00:16:48] This is not like a, you know, promotion where I can just run around willy nilly and do what I want. Like,

[00:16:55] Ka-Ce: No, she’s still like a slave. She’s just now the personal slave of the king.

[00:17:01] James: yeah, and she gets paid.

[00:17:05] Ka-Ce: yeah, her freedom is still restricted. If she doesn’t do what he says, he will kill her, or he will kill those closest to her.

[00:17:15] James: Yeah, and so, so we have, we have that, and then, so Celaena now is feeling You know pressured into telling her the truth, and I don’t think she was planning to tell her at this point But she was she felt like she had to because Nehemia’s like you know You’re killing people and every time you kill someone I just don’t think I can I can stay your your friend and da da da and like come on That is like the absolute shittiest thing When you know that your friend is suffering – Celaena didn’t want to be the champion But she also didn’t want to go back to Endovier.

[00:17:53] Ka-Ce: Right? Like, they all, like, the group, Nehemia, Dorian, and Chaol, [00:18:00] they were all supporting her throughout the championship. At the final battle, they were like, Come on, girl, you gotta do this, you got to win, you have to become the king’s champion, and the minute she does become the king’s champion, like, everybody flips.

[00:18:15] James: Everyone’s like, Uh, how could you? It’s like, what do you mean how could I?

[00:18:21] Ka-Ce: Yeah,

[00:18:21] James: That the, that was the whole point!

[00:18:28] You know, so, so, Celaena has been pressured now into bringing Nehemia into the fold. And immediately we get shown that there are some things here that, that Celaena seems to be piecing together and Nehemia is like, oh, oh, uh, no, that’s not, hmm, that doesn’t sound right.

[00:18:51] Ka-Ce: And it was also, to me, it was cagey that, you know, Nehemia is like, as a king’s champion, you need to do more and more, and if you keep killing people, I don’t know if I can be friends with you, and I need to give my parents something to show that you’re, you know, you know. Trustworthy and, you know, savable and blah blah blah.

[00:19:08] And the minute that Celaena breaks and tells Nehemia the truth, how she is trying to save these people and fake their deaths, Nehemia’s like, oh, but, but if the king finds out, he’s gonna kill you. You can’t have it both ways.

[00:19:22] James: Right.

[00:19:24] Ka-Ce: Like, you can’t be sitting there going, don’t kill, don’t kill, but also, oh my god, you’re not killing.

[00:19:30] If the king finds out, you’re gonna be dead. Like, what are you gonna do? Girl.

[00:19:35] James: and yeah, and now, now that you know, that’s just another liability that I have to worry about.

[00:19:43] Ka-Ce: Yes. Yes.

[00:19:46] James: trying to keep this all very tightly under wraps, and I can’t do that now.

[00:19:53] Ka-Ce: That, and her interest, in Archer Finn, is sus.

[00:19:58] James: Well yeah, why was that the one that [00:20:00] she like immediately brought up?

[00:20:02] Ka-Ce: Yes. Super sus.

[00:20:04] James: Because she wouldn’t, I mean, we’re assuming that Nehemia doesn’t know who her current target is, right?

[00:20:11] Ka-Ce: Well, Celaena did tell Nehemia about Archer Finn

[00:20:15] James: Oh, did she?

[00:20:16] Ka-Ce: Yes, she did. I don’t know, just the way she asks about Archer Finn and comments on him, it I feel like she’s more interested in Archer Finn than just, you know, a random

[00:20:31] James: little too concerned, uh, in this random guy that Celaena hasn’t talked to in years. And, uh, like, how do you know Archer Finn, Nehemia? Because he doesn’t seem like the kind of person that you would keep company with. Like

[00:20:49] Ka-Ce: Right, for a court… like maybe some of the others them being lords and holding titles and stuff, Nehemia would be a bit more Like, wanting to know about them as a princess, but as a courtesan, what interest does Nehemia have in this guy? And just also, Nehemia was just so quick to dismiss Celaena’s working theory about the eye of Elena, and this eye riddle, and the eye discovery in the tomb. It’s just all too coincidental.

[00:21:24] James: And Davis having the book.

[00:21:28] Ka-Ce: And I get that Nehemia was like, oh, you know, centuries ago, the eyes were all the rave about protection and blah, blah, blah. Yes, fine, but all of a sudden we’re getting a bunch of these eye things right now, like. Why, uh, why wouldn’t you be more like, oh, yeah, we should discuss this.

[00:21:51] We should see if these are related. It’s a possible avenue, and if it turns out we’re wrong, we’re wrong, and then we’ll go search in [00:22:00] a different direction.

[00:22:01] James: It really does feel like she was trying to, uh, steer her in a different direction.

[00:22:08] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:22:08] James: It’s like, I thought you were helping her. Like,

[00:22:14] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:22:15] James: why are you trying to, unless she’s just trying to shift her focus to something else so that Celaena will help her

[00:22:26] Ka-Ce: With her cause.

[00:22:27] James: with her cause, instead of focusing on, you know. This riddle and this, you know, whatever. It’s like, yeah, yeah, that’s, that’s fine and all, but I have a very real problem. people are gonna, yeah, just like, Still don’t want to get involved in this.

[00:22:44] I’ve told you before. Yeah.

[00:22:48] Ka-Ce: It was also curious that Fleetfoot did not want to accompany the women down to the tomb and instead waited in Celina’s room. And as animal lovers, as you can clearly see on our YouTube here with our babies, that should be a sign that there is something down there or something has taken up residence or something is lingering.

[00:23:11] You should not dismiss animal reservations.

[00:23:14] James: Maybe he just doesn’t like Mort.

[00:23:18] Ka-Ce: Maybe, maybe he could sense.

[00:23:20] James: he,

[00:23:21] Ka-Ce: A Fleetfoot she.

[00:23:22] James: She. Maybe she doesn’t like Mort.

[00:23:24] Ka-Ce: Maybe, but it, if your dog or your cat is like, I’m not setting foot in there, you will have to drag me. I would be like, I’m not setting foot down here either.

[00:23:38] James: True

[00:23:39] Ka-Ce: Or let me grab, you know, a bunch of sage in one hand and my pistol in the other sort of thing. And then, but yeah, I just think that we should be more careful down there, according to Fleetfoot. Okay.

[00:23:53] James: it’s not a, that’s not a bad, uh, takeaway

[00:23:59] Ka-Ce: Chapter [00:24:00] 17. Chaol stationed Celaena outside on the patio, hoping that her temper would cool. And it didn’t. The queen was throwing a ball in honor of Hollin. And seriously, how many parties did this kid need? Hollin was throwing a fit, because of course he was, on his mini glass throne, shoveling sweets into his mouth.

[00:24:17] And Dorian was dancing with lady after lady. Chaol turned back to find Celaena had abandoned her post, and she instead was waltzing in the darkness with herself. She just wanted one moment to feel like a normal girl. Instead of reprimanding her on the spot, Chaol asked her to dance with him. This was different than when Dorian had asked her to dance with him at the Yule Ball.

[00:24:38] At that time, Chaol had also rejected dancing with her. But now he was asking her, telling her that things were different now. And so they danced, flawless and lethal, both acknowledging that they would never be a normal boy and girl. And after ten long years, Celaena realized she was home when looking at Chaol. Dorian managed to sneak away from the ladies and wanted to step outside. One glance at Chaol and Celaena dancing stopped him in his tracks. Nehemia joined him, asking him not to cause trouble for the dancing pair. That day, her and Dorian had burdens, responsibilities that Chaol and Celaena Didn’t and wouldn’t understand.

[00:25:19] Nehemia also tells Dorian what information Roland had provided her. The king has approved Councilman Mollison’s plans to swell Calaculla’s ranks, i.e. making the labor camp bigger with more people. Roland wants Nehemia to tell her father to agree to this plan to make things go more smoothly. Of course, Nehemia flat out refuses.

[00:25:41] She asks Dorian to speak to his father, as she is not allowed in the council room. And Dorian tells her he can’t. And like with Celaena, Nehemia confronts him. He can’t, or he won’t. And if Celaena were sent back to the mines, to Endovier or Calaculla, would he try and free her? [00:26:00] Did he have any second thoughts to the thousands at those camps? Before leaving him, Nehemia traced a symbol on his chest and told him that he has power in him, more than he realizes. For now it sleeps, but when it awakens, she will help him with it. Dorian wondered what she meant by that, and why, when she said those words, something ancient and slumbering within him opened an eye.

[00:26:27] James: dude. That’s like so much foreshadowing right there.

[00:26:33] Ka-Ce: So much foreshadowing.

[00:26:35] James: Like, it’s one of those things that you don’t catch until you do a reread. Um, yeah. Like, just so much. Uh, just like, like,

[00:26:46] Ka-Ce: you having another brain explosion?

[00:26:49] James: well, that, and then also like, dude. Dorian gets so, like, shafted.

[00:26:58] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:26:59] James: I don’t want to spoil it for anybody because this is a spoiler free. Heh heh heh heh.

[00:27:06] Ka-Ce: But yes, there is a lot to unpack in this chapter. Um, we do see Chaol and Celaena. They are continuous, continuously growing ever closer together. And for her to look upon Chaol and feel like she’s at home, I think speaks volumes. You know, especially with this journey that she’s been on for the past year, year and a half or so.

[00:27:30] Um, you know, and, and given how they met in Throne of Glass, where they were constantly bumping heads with each other and he didn’t want to speak to her. He didn’t want to know anything about her. And now look at where they are. That just

[00:27:45] James: honestly was a turn in their relationship that I was not really expecting. Um, because they had a tendency to butt heads so much.

[00:27:56] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:27:57] James: Um, but, you know, [00:28:00] as I mentioned. I think in the last or the one before, uh, in this, in this book, um, so far, Chaol has really pulled up, like, he’s, she is getting, you know, shit from Dorian, she’s getting pressured from Nehemia, and now she’s literally got, Chaol who’s on her side and he’s like, I want to help and she’s like, I don’t want your help and he’s like, okay, cool I’m gonna chill right here.

[00:28:35] I think you should take my help, but it’s cool. You want to talk about it? You don’t want to talk about it? It’s cool. Like, you know, he’s he’s not pressuring her to do anything other than kind of like Not to forget who she is Which was a

[00:28:55] Ka-Ce: Go ahead.

[00:28:56] James: I was just gonna say, that was a big flip on his character from the first book where he’s like You’re an assassin and I can’t believe you did this and uh, and now in here he’s like I get it You’re in a crappy position I get it, you know, like he had a life changing moment

[00:29:18] Ka-Ce: I mean, killing somebody is quite life changing. But yeah, it Funny to think that killing Cain to save her is what finally, like, made him. come around to her. Like, we saw him start to break and start to feel more and care about her, but then he would immediately, like, put up that wall between them. And yeah, that whole confrontation and taking a life, I think, just really made Cai-, made Chaol wake up and See things in a new light.

[00:29:59] And I have to [00:30:00] say, my first read, I was not loving it because I wanted her with Dorian. And I was still so mad about how that all played out and I was just like, no. But reading it again, I can appreciate it more. Their, their budding relationship and their growing relationship.

[00:30:23] James: feel like, um, Nehemia and shit, no, Celaena and Dorian, um, are good on paper, but it’s not the kind of thing that lasts.

[00:30:38] Ka-Ce: It’s more of like a high school, early college sort of relationship.

[00:30:43] James: Yeah,

[00:30:44] Ka-Ce: Where you’re still trying to find yourself, you guys could have been great friends, but it’s not marriage or long term.

[00:30:54] James: yeah, I just, I don’t, I don’t see how that could have ever, because So he’s the prince, and she definitely does not want to be a princess or a queen, right, to him, because that’s a, that’s a whole nother sentence right there. Um, and if he gave up his, you know, his royal heritage to what, follow her out into the world, he’s only known a life of pomp and excess and glorious, you know, clothing.

[00:31:28] Mm

[00:31:29] Ka-Ce: Mm hmm.

[00:31:30] James: He would not know what to do with himself

[00:31:35] Ka-Ce: No,

[00:31:36] James: After more than like two weeks.

[00:31:38] Ka-Ce: They both have a lot of growing up to do still, and they need to do it separately. And even then I think they would be, they would work better as friends than trying to start again romantically. It just, it, it’s one of those young relationships where you’re still learning yourself. You’re [00:32:00] just still discovering what you like, what you don’t like.

[00:32:04] But yeah, they work better as friends.

[00:32:08] I still didn’t like it.

[00:32:14] James: Um, yeah, and so then, you know, on top of that now we’ve got, uh, I don’t remember what the original thought there was. But we have a lot of things going on. Nehemia is back to playing games. Like, that’s what it feels like.

[00:32:38] Ka-Ce: I agree.

[00:32:38] James: For… I’m pretty sure that at some point they were like, her and Celaena were like, you know, honesty, no more secrets, kind of like, whatever, whatever.

[00:32:50] And even though they’re both back to secrets, right? I feel like Celaena’s, doesn’t have a choice in the secrets that she’s keeping because, you know, she’s literally defying the king.

[00:33:04] Ka-Ce: Yea.

[00:33:05] James: And Nehemia is now back to… You know, not talking about, um, what she knows. Now she’s like, cryptic messages with Dorian, and like,

[00:33:21] Ka-Ce: And what’s up with her drawing symbols on the window and then drawing a symbol on his chest, like, what are these symbols? Do they mean anything or is she just drawing nonsensical stuff because that’s how she fidgets? It’s just kinda weird that would draw a symbol on his chest and then he felt something, like, start to awaken within him.

[00:33:50] James: yeah, I really want to know, like, what she drew on him, because, uh, that was, uh, that was odd.

[00:33:57] Ka-Ce: Right? I mean, we had started seeing, like, [00:34:00] little glimpses of things leading up to this point with Dorian, and him feeling the cold and the frost, but What does she know? What does she sense about Dorian? And, yeah, what, what did she draw?

[00:34:15] James: Well, I mean, and she tells him that That she will help him when it awakens. So clearly she’s anticipating something is going to happen to him.

[00:34:28] Ka-Ce: But, oh, go ahead.

[00:34:29] James: I was going to say, something’s going to happen and he’s not going to be able to handle it. And she supposedly will be able to help him handle it, right? So, where is this knowledge coming from?

[00:34:44] Ka-Ce: Mm hmm. And what a risk. That she’s talking to him about it at the ball. Where the king could overhear, or one of his spies could overhear. You know, what’s to stop Dorian from turning her in and being like She’s speaking about magic, or she’s speaking heresy, or whatever. This is great grounds to, you know, get her sent back to Eyllwe, or, you know, confine her, hold her at ransom.

[00:35:16] We know that Dorian is better than that, but if he’s freaked out, this is a good way to save his ass. But then it would be outing him, that he might have something within him, you know. Yeah.

[00:35:30] James: Definitely not something that you want leaked out to anybody. You just keep that all bottled up, locked inside, and just, nope. Not talking about it. Not, uh, what did you hear me say? You didn’t hear me say that. I was saying, I really like the shape of her dress? Cause And when she was saying, she, she couldn’t wait to unlock my masculine power. [00:36:00] You know. Cause I’m so manly.

[00:36:06] Ka-Ce: Yeah. Look at my sword. It’s so long.

[00:36:09] James: Look at my big, long sword.

[00:36:13] Ka-Ce: It’s sharp

[00:36:13] James: I’m the Prince. Huzzah. dear Lord, chapter 18, Celaena had been distracted during her Wyrdmark lessons with Nehemia. Chaol, for his part, does not mention the dancing during their morning workout. And she’s exhausted. But, she has to confront Archer. She needs more than a list of names. She needs to know what they’re planning and how much they know about the king.

[00:36:52] Archer begged her for more time, but Celaena held firm. The king gave her a deadline, so Archer has a deadline. He has six days to come up with something to give her or else. Dorian is filled with an icy rage as he studies the maps and figures of Calaculla.

[00:37:12] Uh, in the council chamber. He should have fought to get Nehemia into this meeting.

[00:37:19] Calaculla couldn’t support the current number of slaves. There were just too many. and if they were to start mining just north

[00:37:27] bleh..ok,

[00:37:29] but if they were to start mining just north of there, they could erect buildings for the guards and the overseers, but not for the slaves. The slaves could sleep in the mines.

[00:37:41] Dorian noticed that not only do his father and Perrington wear black rings, but Roland also has one now. Dorian confronted his father, and the council, that if they keep swelling the mines, there would [00:38:00] be no one left. He tells Roland and Mullison That they should spend a year in Calaculla, then they can come back and talk of plans for expanding.

[00:38:11] Dorian tells everyone his vote is no before storming out.

[00:38:16] Making his way down to the ancient stone castle, Dorian found a secluded hallway and punched the wall with all his might. He felt freezing cold, but the cold fueled his calm rage. The stone wall cracked and the window exploded.

[00:38:34] When Dorian picked himself up, he realized the area surrounding him was clear of glass and wood and stone.

[00:38:42] This shouldn’t have been possible unless it was magic. This made Dorian sick. While spending more time in Chaol’s room than her own or in the library, Celaena laments that she should hire someone like Philippa so that she They could bring them cake and cookies, cause girl knows, she loves her sweets.

[00:39:04] Ka-Ce: She has priorities. Good ones.

[00:39:07] James: Chaol leaves, and comes back with chocolate cake. After eating half the cake, Chaol passes out and Celaena can’t help but think that Chaol is one of the good ones. In a court, a kingdom that valued honor and loyalty could rise again if it had people like Chaol. But the king of Adarlan would strike it down.

[00:39:31] Leaving his room, the other half of the cake in hand, Celaena finds Dorian outside her room sitting in the hallway. He’s distraught, looking for Nehemia, but she is nowhere to be found. Celaena invites him in, and for a second, there’s something in his eyes that reminded her of a world long since burned, a glimmer of color and power, but he blinks and walks away.

[00:39:57] Ka-Ce: We see that, like, [00:40:00] mentioned several times, you know, about a world long since burned. Kind of reminding her of home and stuff. It’s just, uh,

[00:40:10] James: Yeah, I

[00:40:11] Ka-Ce: another foreshadowing,

[00:40:13] James: she’s seeing things in people and circumstances that are forcing her to remember things, things that she does not want to remember.

[00:40:24] Ka-Ce: No. She’s not ready.

[00:40:29] James: Um, so, so Celaena and Nehemia, you know, they’re doing the lessons in the Wyrdmarks again. Although, at this point, you kind of have to wonder if, Nehemia is even doing it, like, correctly, because it seems like she’s trying to lead her off into the weeds on things anymore.

[00:40:51] Ka-Ce: I feel like they should have started the whole Wyrdmark thing a lot earlier. Especially, like, with The murders, you know, that were taking place with the champions, and there were Wyrdmarks surrounding them. Like, Celaena had started kind of researching them on her own. And then, she became king’s champion, and it just kind of like, fell to the wayside, but she knew that there was more to it, and more surrounding the king, like, and she knew that Nehemia knew about the Wyrdmarks.

[00:41:26] I just felt like this was a long time coming, and they should have started this studying a lot sooner.

[00:41:33] James: It does seem like something that they would have started, like, immediately after, um, her whole encounter with, um, You know, the, um, the final challenge, you know, where she was dealing with the, um, the, the spirits of the dead and Nehemia is doing the Wyrdmarks to save her and, you know, all this stuff, like, get through all that, let her heal.

[00:41:59] And they’ve been [00:42:00] like, okay, you need to know, like how this stuff works. Yes. I do the one under your bed. It was a protection one. We’ll start with that one.

[00:42:08] Ka-Ce: Alright, let’s start with the easy, basic ones and work our way up. Yeah, I don’t know.

[00:42:16] James: Yeah, it’s uh,

[00:42:20] Ka-Ce: And maybe if they had started with that, it would have built their relationship and their trust. Instead of Nehemia just constantly pushing, you know, the plight of her people. They could have built upon the Wyrdmarks and then Celaena would have felt more at ease with Nehemia. And other things could have happened between them more organically, like letting Nehemia know that she’s not actually killing these people and

[00:42:50] James: yeah, uh, it, it just, you can’t help but wonder if, if one of the two of them was putting it off, like, yeah we’ll do it later, yeah we’ll do it later. But I need you to help me with this. My people are really in need. It’s like, well, yes, but I am also in need, I need to understand how this stuff works.

[00:43:18] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:43:18] James: And it’s like, well, yeah, we’ll get to it, we’ll get to it, but my people need help.

[00:43:23] You know, it’s like, okay, you’re not listening.

[00:43:26] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:43:28] James: Kind of what it feels like.

[00:43:31] Ka-Ce: Speaking of Nehemia and continuing on this topic, do you think Nehemia is the one that unleashed something with Dorian? I know we kind of briefly talked about it last chapter, like, how does she know that something is there? That’s what I want to know.

[00:43:49] James: I am wondering now if, if she was partly responsible for For this change that is happening in Dorian.

[00:43:59] Ka-Ce: [00:44:00] Yeah, I feel like,

[00:44:00] James: There is clearly something happening to Dorian.

[00:44:04] Ka-Ce: like we, we were noticing like little bits, you know? Leading up to this chapter. But I feel like after she drew that symbol And stuff It awoken more And that’s when he You know went and punched the wall and Was that the catalyst Was she setting him up or

[00:44:29] James: I want to, I would like to know

[00:44:35] this is only the first time we’re told that she’s done something Like, straight up to him, she’s like, hello, here’s your chest, and ch ch, right? And he’s like, what the hell? Um But do we know if she hasn’t been doing this the whole time? Like, you know,

[00:44:54] Ka-Ce: Ooh

[00:44:55] James: has he been in proximity of her and she’s been over in the corner, like,

[00:45:01] (wild gestures) and, like, like, unlocking, you know, like, little bit by little bit, chipping away, you know? If Nehemia had never come,

[00:45:11] would Dorian’s whatever never manifested?

[00:45:16] Ka-Ce: Mmm

[00:45:16] James: I mean

[00:45:18] I mean, it’s clearly magic, right? Um,

[00:45:22] Ka-Ce: Yea

[00:45:22] James: so

[00:45:22] Ka-Ce: Which is also another thing, but continue

[00:45:26] James: Yeah, I know. In a world with no magic, there seems to be an abundance of magic. I’m just curious now, if he had never encountered her, would that never have manifested in him? Has she been chipping at him? And then finally, She came in and she was like, Okay, enough chipping. Ch ch ch, dam is open. Like….

[00:45:53] Ka-Ce: Or, here’s a big enough hole, that the rest will just come crashing out

[00:45:57] James: Or, yeah, I’m taking, it’s like, [00:46:00] Tink, tink, tink, chip.

[00:46:01] Ya know?

[00:46:02] I just wonder, did she set this thing up from the beginning? Was it so that he would be forced to come to her and then he would be an asset for her cause because she would need to train like, there seems like there’s a whole thought out plan here that we are not privy to. Um,

[00:46:22] Ka-Ce: we don’t really get any, like, point of view stuff from Nehemia. It’s either Celaena, Dorian, or Chaol. maybe every once in a while we get something with the king and Perrington. But we don’t ever really get anything from Nehemia. That would have been such great, like, story if we could have gotten some of her stuff.

[00:46:46] James: That would be, those would be great bonus chapters like the things in Assassin’s Blade, you know, um, if we could have had a chapter, well I mean we had the one chapter, right? Yeah, where they, no, it wasn’t in Assassin’s Blade but it was the one chapter where they went for the dress, try on the dress, right? We could have gotten another Nehemia chapter of her laying out her plan

[00:47:14] Ka-Ce: With whoever.

[00:47:15] James: whatever her plan was. And then,

[00:47:20] you know, the follow through on how that turns out, um,

[00:47:25] because I’m just curious. I feel like she, I do actually really feel like, like she did this to him, like it was in him,

[00:47:35] Ka-Ce: Yea

[00:47:35] James: but I think it would have stayed in him.

[00:47:38] Ka-Ce: Stayed dormant a little longer or just stayed dormant forever?

[00:47:43] James: One or the other. Maybe. I do feel like part of it is his, um. Um, his emotions, and as he’s feeling these, like, this res…, so maybe it’s also part of the whole thing with [00:48:00] Celaena, like, him being rejected, and that’s not something he’s ever gone through, and being jealous of Chaol, and, you know, all these emotions, and so the power is like, ha ha, I know those emotions!

[00:48:14] Ka-Ce: I think too, the feeling the, uh, the frustration with his father, you know, his father’s this big tyrant doing all these things and Dorian doesn’t agree with how his father’s running the kingdom and taking over everything, and feeling powerless to stop his father and powerless to speak out against his father.

[00:48:35] I’m sure that probably also was like, you know, we keep seeing these little scenes with him where he is just so frustrated because he should have fought for Nehemia to get into this meeting. He should have done this and he should have done that. He should have tried more. And that starts to chip away at a person too, you know.

[00:48:57] Maybe that was

[00:48:59] James: So like, yeah, so his, his, uh, like his lack of power has helped this manifest and come up so that he has power.

[00:49:15] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:49:18] James: But it’s, you know, in a world where magic is against the law. not super helpful magic power.

[00:49:27] Ka-Ce: So, I mean, okay, so, we, we know that magic does not exist, and it hasn’t existed for ten years, because of the king. But we learn from Mort that ancient magic persists outside of that. Like the Wyrdmarks. So would this mean that Dorian has Possibly ancient magic

[00:49:51] James: I mean, that would be the only logical answer to that because, um, [00:50:00] The thing that I don’t understand is, is how, how could his magic be considered ancient magic? But, like, the fae living on the continent, like, they lost their magic, too.

[00:50:17] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[00:50:18] James: And wouldn’t they be, like, the most ancient of magic? So, so why do the actual magical creatures, the fae, get their stuff stripped away, you know?

[00:50:32] I mean, they get stripped away, the, the, um The fae that can shapeshift into animals, they all get stuck in whatever form they’re in. Um, and then now you’ve got this very, you know, human character. Magic! Ha! Like, what the hell?

[00:50:58] Ka-Ce: Well, hopefully, uh, we’ll get some answers soon.

[00:51:01] James: I don’t get it. Uh, and, and then of course, you know. On top of all that, we have Dorian noticing that, um, the black rings seem to be growing. Um, and this is where I was really convinced that Roland had no idea what he was getting into when they talked about how he had one on. I said, Oh yeah, Roland. I think he came in and was like, yeah, I’m going to be big, you know, play with the big guys, whatever.

[00:51:33] And they were like, Oh, we got a plan for you. Here’s a ring. And it was like, Oh wait, what? And that’s it. Like, I think Roland just got screwed from the get go. I think he, he thought it was going to go different.

[00:51:48] Ka-Ce: He was thinking power and wealth and the ladies and rising above his station and

[00:51:55] James: Yeah, I think he was, he’s just another pawn. You know, I won’t say he’s the next [00:52:00] Cain because obviously he’s not, you know, big and murderous and all that, but

[00:52:05] Ka-Ce: But there are different ways to use the black rings as we have seen with Cain and Kaltain and I guess we’ll see what happens with Roland.

[00:52:15] James: yeah Yes, Oh good old Archer

[00:52:26] Ka-Ce: Archer

[00:52:27] James: I do not trust Archer 100 percent I think he’s a skeeze.

[00:52:33] Ka-Ce: He is looking more and more sus. Like, if, if you were given a timeline to get your affairs in order and get out, wouldn’t you be rushing to do that? I feel like he’s dragging his feet.

[00:52:48] James: For a man who had his life threatened, he doesn’t act very threatened.

[00:52:53] Ka-Ce: No.

[00:52:54] James: And pushing the envelope with like, I need this. And I need, it’s like, you are not in a position to barter. Like the King actually wanted you dead. Like a while ago, and I have managed to keep you alive because I need information like So give me some frickin information

[00:53:14] Ka-Ce: And the fact that he lists names just so blatantly in a letter and sends it to the castle where the king could have people intercept it, like that’s just dumb. He deals with secrets and he deals with high lords and everything and he, he knows better. This just seems so,

[00:53:36] James: It’s sloppy

[00:53:37] Ka-Ce: ugh, it’s so sloppy. And it seems on purpose.

[00:53:41] It’s sloppy on purpose.

[00:53:43] James: Yeah. A person in his position would not make a mistake like that you would never risk that because That stuff would Would be read by somebody. It always [00:54:00] is

[00:54:00] Ka-Ce: Mm hmm. And I’m so mad that Celaena has blinders on.

[00:54:07] James: again.

[00:54:08] Ka-Ce: Again. She is relying on this old relationship from when she was like 13, 13, 14. You’re dumb at that age. Like, I was dumb at that age. Like, I thought I was a shit, you know, in junior high. And, yeah, looking back at that, like, no honey, you still have a lot of growing to do.

[00:54:31] Celaena, you know better. The closest people to you have betrayed you time and time again. You should be questioning everything Archer is telling you. And I don’t feel like she is.

[00:54:45] James: Right. Why would you not think immediately? Like he’s immediately going to try and figure out how to save his own skin. Um, he’s not gonna just volunteer information just out of the goodness of his heart. Yeah, she is being way too casual with the whole, the whole thing. Now, to her credit, thankfully, she was like, I need more than names.

[00:55:15] I need, like, details, man, details.

[00:55:19] Ka-Ce: Yeah. Something that she could present to the king, you know.

[00:55:26] James: but see, I feel like her doing that, he is pushing back on her because he doesn’t have details. He’s like, I got a list of names, boom, maybe she’ll leave me alone. And she’s like, no, I need more. And he’s like, shit, I don’t have more. I need, I need time to, to find the information. I feel like he’s making it up, you know, and he’s got to go and find something believable now to give her so that she will leave him alone.

[00:55:55] Ka-Ce: Yeah. Uh,

[00:55:59] James: Um,[00:56:00]

[00:56:00] Ka-Ce: A lot of, a lot of people in this book so far not to trust and to keep an eye on. And we’re not even halfway through yet.

[00:56:11] James: frustrating people. I’m telling you right now, too damn. Trusting all the wrong people and being wary of all the other wrong people, like, flip em. You gotta flip em.

[00:56:24] Ka-Ce: Right.

[00:56:26] James: Crimeny girl.

[00:56:30] Ka-Ce: I was gonna say that. Alright, chapter 19. Chaol wanted to act on his feelings for Celaena. He had felt her touch on him before she had left his room the night before, and it was hard to pretend to be asleep while she had done so. But standing before the king now, he was glad he hadn’t acted on anything. He gave his report.

[00:56:52] His loyalty was still with Dorian and the king. Without it, he was nothing. There was a carnival, and the king wanted Chaol and his men to watch the castle grounds. The king also ordered Chaol to watch Nehemia. But he doesn’t want her alerted to the fact that she has received a death threat. King tells him it’s time to take Nehemia back to Eyllwe, as she has been stirring up trouble.

[00:57:16] Chaol would discreetly have his men watch her, as the king didn’t want more guards posted around her or outside her room. And Chaol decided he wouldn’t warn Nehemia or Celaena. Dorian was exhausted. He hadn’t slept all night, but he needed something, so he came to the barracks, hoping the guards would wear him down.

[00:57:35] Roland approached him after the third guard Dorian sparred with backed away. Roland told him that after Dorian left the council meeting, Roland called off the vote, and Mullison was furious. It was Perrington who told Roland to work with Mullison on this project. Maybe Dorian could work with Roland, steer him away from Perrington. Dorian left Roland and went outside where the [00:58:00] circus, uh, that the queen had commissioned was setting up. Yet again, another party for Hollin. How many parties does this kid need?

[00:58:08] James: Hmm.

[00:58:09] Ka-Ce: One of the covered wagons had a sign. Carnival of mirrors. See illusions and reality collide. What was the queen thinking?

[00:58:17] Illusions and tricks just bordered on the edge of treason. Chaol and Celaena caught up to him. Together, they toured the carnival being set up and ran into Baba Yellowlegs. Baba Yellowlegs confirmed she’s a witch to Celaena, the last born witch in the Witch Kingdom. The group pulled themselves away from the witch.

[00:58:36] Celaena knew about witches, the stories, and legends. She even had a first hand account from a former friend. Seeing as how that friend betrayed and nearly killed her, she hoped that those stories were also lies. But the eye of Elena glowed warm and heavy around her neck, and the witch was wearing a crown of stars.

[00:58:56] Celaena felt this urge, this pull, to go into her wagon. She’d have to return with Nehemia later to see if Nehemia also got some strange sense from this witch. They arrived at the stables, and Dorian gives Chaol a night black Asterion stallion. And Chaol tells him, this gift is too much. This is a gift for a prince.

[00:59:20] Celaena tells them of the time she had an Asterion mare, and how she stole the mare from the Lord of Xandria in the Red Desert. Before departing, Celaena tells the boys she has something special planned for Chaol’s birthday. Alone in her room, Celaena was troubled by the parting words of the witch. The words about fate.

[00:59:41] So she descends to the tomb alone, tired of waiting for Nehemia to do her research. The eye of Alayna would fit perfectly into that eye hole she had discovered. Dun, dun.

[00:59:56] James: Dun dun duuun. So, [01:00:00] the king wants Nehemia gone, but he’s also sort of talking about the fact that there have been death threats against her. Um, I want to know is who would be sending death threats to Nehemia?

[01:00:24] Ka-Ce: Mhm.

[01:00:25] James: Like, what would the What would the purpose be? Because she can’t really do anything other than be kind of annoying, right?

[01:00:38] To the council members and stuff. Like, they’ve been ignoring her this whole time. The king

[01:00:46] Ka-Ce: I think she still, like, rallies hope in the rebels and in the people. that’s annoying.

[01:00:55] James: Yeah, but, I mean, do you really want to turn somebody into a martyr? Like, that seems like a bad choice too.

[01:01:02] Ka-Ce: True.

[01:01:03] James: It doesn’t seem

[01:01:08] Honestly, the king telling Chaol that there’s a death threat or whatever, it seems like a set up. It, it feels like a set up, um, to see what Chaol’s going to do. Um, you know, where does his loyalties lie? Is he more loyal to Celaena? Is he more loyal to Dorian? Is he more, you know, um, he’s the captain of the guard and the king’s like, eh, that’s,

[01:01:36] Ka-Ce: You’re supposed to be loyal to me, let’s see how that goes

[01:01:38] James: and, and you did kill my choice of champion. So, let’s just see what happens if I give this little bit of information here.

[01:01:50] Ka-Ce: Yea. So do you think the King actually wants Chaol to bring her home to Eyllwe [01:02:00] or wants him to bring her “home” and take care of her

[01:02:06] James: I don’t think that he would put that on Chaol. I don’t believe the king thinks Chaol would have it in him to take care of her like that. Um,

[01:02:16] I could see him being like, Yeah, you need to take her back to Eyllwe. And then as soon as she gets back to Eyllwe, Um, She dies. Because of some reason. Like,

[01:02:29] Ka-Ce: Or something happens along

[01:02:30] James: Yeah, but it Not Chaol’s fault, You know, but,

[01:02:36] Ka-Ce: But something.

[01:02:37] James: something.

[01:02:38] I could see that, um,

[01:02:41] and then, with the whole thing about there being the death threats on there, It still just very much feels like a setup to me.

[01:02:52] Ka-Ce: Yea, I can see that.

[01:02:52] James: Why did it come just, just, all of a sudden, like, oh, and by the way,

[01:03:00] Ka-Ce: Yeah, that is true. It seems kind of,

[01:03:05] James: Suspicious.

[01:03:10] Um, and, yeah, reading through here again, I am Without spoiling anything. I can see the reference with the friends and the horses and As you guys are reading this, read Assassin’s Blade. Remember the horse and the friends. And the Red Desert, because that’s a good, uh

[01:03:30] Ka-Ce: It’s a good tie in.

[01:03:32] James: It is a good tie in.

[01:03:33] Ka-Ce: So we’ll have to circle back to this when we cover Assassin’s Blade

[01:03:37] James: Yes, because you would think that based on that experience, that, uh, Celaena would be acting a little different. And she’s not.

[01:03:48] Ka-Ce: with some of her friendships.

[01:03:50] James: And it’s a little irritating that every time Celaena comes to a new thing, she immediately forgets the thing that just [01:04:00] happened to her.

[01:04:01] Ka-Ce: Yes.

[01:04:04] James: Girl. Girl. Anyway.

[01:04:11] Ka-Ce: Can we take just a Brief, very brief moment here to comment on the fact how blind the queen is to everything happening around her. I think we, we touched upon this a little bit, um, in Throne of Glass. You know, the queen just being so hyper focused on getting Dorian married and producing babies. Um, And now she’s currently focused only on Hollin and throwing just all of these parties for this kid who doesn’t even look like his brother Dorian, which is also kind of like, hmm?

[01:04:44] Um, but she brought in a circus with a witch. To read Fortunes and have an illusion of mirrors. How far removed is she from the king? Like, the king has outlawed magic, and anyone associated with magic or anything is put to death. Anyone that speaks of it is put to death. Or do you think the king is manipulating the queen in some way, kind of like how they did with Kaltain?

[01:05:18] James: I wouldn’t put that above him. Not to the point where it’s like, you know, black ring manipulation kind of thing, but just, just based off the fact like the king, I could imagine the king being like, yeah, throw a party, bring in the circus and, you know, like, you know, the circus has a witch and him just being like, you know, yeah, but, you know, the witches don’t really have power anymore.

[01:05:50] So it’s fine. She’s just a witch in name.

[01:05:53] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[01:05:53] James: You she’s mortal like the rest of us now, you know, and the king, could just kind of like pass it off like it’s [01:06:00] not a big deal, you know, illusions are not magic, uh, you know, that thing

[01:06:06] Ka-Ce: they border a little bit on

[01:06:08] James: Obviously reading farther along in the story, this whole thing makes way like, oof, uh, can’t.

[01:06:21] Going to get into it, but the whole thing of Baba Yellowlegs being here

[01:06:28] Ka-Ce: Mmmhmm, and the mirrors?

[01:06:30] James: so much more Oh, the mirrors?

[01:06:34] Ka-Ce: Oh, oh shoot. Ok, maybe you haven’t gotten that far, sorry! Rewind, you didn’t hear anything about that

[01:06:40] James: Be kind, rewind!

[01:06:43] Ka-Ce: We just dated ourselves.

[01:06:45] James: if anybody, uh, I’m doing the, uh, cocked, uh, head, uh

[01:06:51] Ka-Ce: Huh?

[01:06:51] James: What? What? Mirrors? What the hell are you talking about? I’m just talking about Baba Yellowlegs being there and the whole, you know, thing with the king and their thing.

[01:07:02] Ka-Ce: Well, okay. If you are annotating or tagging or keeping notes, I would just say three things. Baba Yellowlegs, the crown, and the mirrors. And that’s all I’m gonna say. No other spoilers. Or no real spoilers.

[01:07:20] James: Am I supposed to know something about the crown too?

[01:07:23] Ka-Ce: Not yet.

[01:07:24] James: Oh, okay.

[01:07:25] Ka-Ce: I don’t think.

[01:07:26] James: I’m like, wait, what?

[01:07:30] Ka-Ce: I know, I’m just blowing your mind right now, I’m sorry.

[01:07:32] James: if anybody needs to be reminded, I, I have only gotten as far as, um, how far did I get?

[01:07:43] Ka-Ce: You have the tandem read to do.

[01:07:45] James: I have the tandem read.

[01:07:46] Ka-Ce: You’re on Empire of Storms

[01:07:47] James: Yeah, I’m on Empire of Storms. What’s the one I just read? I can’t think of the name of

[01:07:52] Ka-Ce: Queen of Shadows.

[01:07:53] James: Queen of Shadows, that’s what I just read.

[01:07:58] So I have no idea what you’re talking [01:08:00] about with the mirrors or the crown at this point. Okay, good to know. Something for me to look forward to. I still have half a fourth, um, Onyx Storm to get through and then I can switch back to, um, to do the Tandem Read because that’s going to take all my brain power. Um, But anyway, yes, make annotations. Remember this whole thing with Baba Yellowlegs and why she would even be allowed to be here in the castle near the king because typically I don’t think that would even be allowed.

[01:08:36] Ka-Ce: No, I feel like the king would, would like capture Baba Yellowlegs and sentence her to death right away. I mean, we saw how he reacted with Rena, you know, singing a poem song about an ancient Fae lady and all of that, you know, and that was just talking about the Fae. And here’s a, here’s a real witch and yeah, she may be powerless.

[01:09:04] But, still a witch.

[01:09:08] James: She may be powerless. We don’t actually know if the, if the witches actually follow. Because, I mean, we’ve seen other ancient magic that apparently doesn’t give a shit about the wards, so, uh, sorry, not the wards, wrong, wrong, I mean that kind of wards.

[01:09:27] Ka-Ce: The Black tower

[01:09:28] James: Black Tower, I mean that is basically a ward. Um, sorry, I’m crossing my, my, my books here, but it’s basically the same thing. But we already have so many different things that are outright defying this. Dorian, the Wyrdmarks, uh, Mort, Elena, um,

[01:09:54] Ka-Ce: The eye of Elena

[01:09:55] James: so the eye of Elena, I mean, so who’s to say that the witches can’t sit there and [01:10:00] be like, Oh yeah, I have no power. Yeeeaah.

[01:10:04] Ka-Ce: Curse curse curse

[01:10:05] James: Yea, right. Like, you know, maybe they only lost some of their power.

[01:10:14] Who’s to say, right.

[01:10:15] Ka-Ce: Yea

[01:10:16] James: I certainly wouldn’t put her within a stone’s throw, you know. I mean,

[01:10:21] it just seems like a bad choice, honestly.

[01:10:25] Ka-Ce: There is a lot going on, a lot behind the scenes, and yea. We’ll see how this goes.

[01:10:34] James: Why do you think, I really want to know why, with the way that Dorian has been acting and feeling and everything, that he suddenly is gifting Chaol this magnificent beast of a horse.

[01:10:51] Ka-Ce: I think they’ve just they’ve always been like bros, and besties

[01:10:56] James: But it, it seems like, like so much. I don’t know

[01:11:02] Ka-Ce: over extravagant.

[01:11:03] James: Yeah, to the point where Chaol’s like, no, like, This is clearly out of character.

[01:11:13] Ka-Ce: yeah. Hmm.

[01:11:15] James: Because if it had been anything else, I think Chaol would have been like, Alright, cool, yeah, like, you know, like, yay, thanks, whatever. But for him to look at a gift from Dorian and be like, no, like, this is obscene.

[01:11:27] Ka-Ce: Like, this is a gift you would give to Dorian.

[01:11:30] James: Exactly. Yeah, Dorian, Dorian gives this gift to Dorian. Not to, not to his friend, the guard, you know, Captain. Um, I just wonder if, um, is Dorian like overcompensating because he’s been jealous or because of his freak out thing with the magic and he’s like, I need to do something to like,

[01:11:59] Ka-Ce: Feel [01:12:00] normal.

[01:12:00] James: Feel normal, feel better. And so he’s like, here’s this great gift.

[01:12:03] It’s like giving somebody a Corvette, you know? And your friend being like, bro, I work at, you know, fricking. Um, Staple Center, like, I can’t.

[01:12:16] Ya know, it just, it struck me as a little odd and out of character with the way that Dorian has been acting and because he’s been so jealous of

[01:12:26] Ka-Ce: Their relationship

[01:12:26] James: everything, and he’s now having anger issues on top of all this and then Nehemia’s like, I’ll help you train, oh voodoo, you know, and,

[01:12:36] Ka-Ce: But i feel like trying to get one of those horses because they are so special and, like, rare that it would have taken some months of planning and negotiating to get one. And I feel Dorian is also kind of a giver, too. Like, I mean, for Christmas he gave er, Yulemas, sorry. He gave Celaena, you know, a bag of candy and Fleetfoot. Knowing how hard she, you know, stuck up for Fleetfoot as a baby. He just seems kind of like a giver.

[01:13:12] Even though, you know, he might be a little pompous at times, and ladies man and all that. I feel like for those he cares about, he’s always gonna give, like, big gifts. And I also felt like it was more, this was a good way for Celaena to be like, oh yeah, I had a mare version of this. Not a stallion, but the mare, and I stole her.

[01:13:38] James: I guess, I mean, I guess that would make sense if he would have to plan that. Like,

[01:13:43] Ka-Ce: I mean, that’s just my thoughts. I didn’t We just read it different,

[01:13:49] James: yeah. Well, I mean, that’s the whole thing. Like somebody reads something one way and somebody reads it the next way, and then you say, huh,[01:14:00]

[01:14:00] Ka-Ce: Who knows? Maybe it was supposed to be a horse for Dorian himself. You know, he is the prince, so he needs A majestic beast, and he was overcompensating, like you said, like, Chaol’s birthday was coming up, and he’s been seeing Chaol and Celaena get closer and closer, and he’s feeling jealous and left out, and Maybe he was like, yeah, I don’t need this horse.

[01:14:23] I’m gonna give it to Chaol, so Chaol will be back on my side. Be my best friend again

[01:14:27] James: you, you imagine Like, here you go, and what, what’d you get him Celaena? It’s just like, what do you mean what did I get him? Not a horse

[01:14:42] Ka-Ce: I mean, yeah, like, how do you top off? Something like that. I guess we’ll see later.

[01:14:54] James: Okay. Chapter 20.

[01:14:59] we’re back in the tomb. In the tomb, Celaena confronts, confronted Mort wanting to know if the amulet truly has power and what it actually does. Mort confirms that it does have power and it protects you and it guards you from harm. Without wasting any time, she tried to fit the amulet into the eye groove. It sort of fit. Peering into it, the wall on the other side didn’t change. She tried flipping, rotating, and tilting the amulet, but no luck.

[01:15:34] She tried saying “times rift”, as if it were a spell, and had no luck.

[01:15:40] Mort informs her that she still hasn’t asked the proper questions. Angry, Celaena storms back to her room.

[01:15:48] Always on this night, Celaena has the same dream. Of her standing on the ledge, a dark endless ravine stretched between her and a white stag.

[01:15:58] The same stag that she had [01:16:00] spotted through the bars of her prison wagon on the way to Endovier. Celaena awoke from the dream and left the castle before dawn. Uh, Chaol waited for her at dawn for training, and when she didn’t show up, he went to her room and found Nehemia sipping tea instead. Mahimian informed him that today was the 10th anniversary of her parents death and she left a note saying she took today off.

[01:16:27] So…

[01:16:32] Ka-Ce: Go ahead

[01:16:34] James: we’re just all over the place. Um, I was going to say, so now it, I was going to say in, in Elena’s stead, we have Mort who is being very unhelpfully helpful. Um, Or, helpfully, unhelpful.

[01:16:53] Ka-Ce: Either one works.

[01:16:56] James: Where she’s like, What the hell do I do with this? And he’s like, you know, You gotta do this, but you’re doing it wrong. Well, how do I do it right? Don’t do it wrong.

[01:17:06] Ka-Ce: (frustrated sighs) This, this frustrated me to no end. Um, and it’s repeated within Fourth Wing too. You have to ask the right questions. Or, I shouldn’t say Fourth Wing, I should say Iron Flame. You have to ask the right questions. How the hell am I supposed to know which questions to ask? If you’re not giving me any context clues.

[01:17:31] James: Right?

[01:17:31] Ka-Ce: You’re just being snarky with me.

[01:17:33] James: I need a frame of reference so that I know what it is I’m looking at.

[01:17:38] Ka-Ce: Yes, exactly. Don’t be snarky with me. If I, if I mention something about this amulet and this eye or whatever lead me somewhere so I do ask the right questions. Like, uh. It’s like a miscommunication trope. But not between [01:18:00] lovers, though.

[01:18:02] James: No, just miscommunication in general.

[01:18:05] Ka-Ce: Yeah, like you’re purposefully being unhelpful.

[01:18:11] And regardless if this is part of the character’s arc journey or whatever, we also know time is of the essence. And the sooner they can answer some of these questions, the sooner they can get to the next thing. And instead, you’re just being like, ask better questions. Don’t be a dumbass.

[01:18:33] James: Yea. I mean, to, to just, Mort might not be able to control that.

[01:18:40] Ka-Ce: Yeah, being

[01:18:41] James: he’s magically, you know, whatever, and it might very much be like, you can’t give her the answers and it’s like, okay, like he might not have a choice.

[01:18:53] Ka-Ce: Yeah, but I feel like he could, I don’t know, Maybe be like, be snarky about something, like be snarky about This rune , and then she could be like, what fucking rune ? He’d be like, the one that you’re fucking standing on, and then she could be like, What does this rune do? And then he could be like, oh, this rune does blah blah blah.

[01:19:20] You know, like, kind of a leading sort of? While still being the smartass?

[01:19:28] James: Yeah, that’s true. I will admit when I was reading this, I really thought that, um, my train of thought was going exactly the same as hers with the eye. And I was like, yeah, she could put the eye up and it’s going to be like, boom, constellation upside down. And it’s plotting a course to something. And then she did it and there was nothing.

[01:19:43] And I was like, well, shit. Okay. Um, apparently I missed the same thing she missed cause.

[01:19:50] Ka-Ce: I thought she was on to something too, but I felt like she needed to be there at a certain time. Like, it was light. [01:20:00] Light, um

[01:20:02] James: Because light does come through onto the sarcophagus, right?

[01:20:05] Ka-Ce: Yea, so either she needs like high noon or midnight on a full moon or a blood moon or an eclipse or something. But she’s, she acts very rash, Celaena’s very like short tempered and impatient.

[01:20:21] And she’s like, okay, well this doesn’t fit exactly and I still can’t see anything. Mort’s not giving me answers, so I’m gonna storm off instead of being like. Mort, does this amulet go to this eye hole? Yes or no? Okay, I’m still not seeing anything. Does this require a spell? Yes or no? No. Okay. Do I need to come back at midnight?

[01:20:46] Or, you know, like, There’s so many things and I feel like she is just like, This didn’t work. Fuck this. I’m leaving. And then maybe later she’ll get another idea and come and be like, Oh, this didn’t work. Fuck this. I’m leaving.

[01:21:01] James: Yeah, it’s a lot of wasted time because she’s too impatient to like methodically

[01:21:09] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[01:21:10] James: Go through things

[01:21:11] Ka-Ce: And I feel like as an assassin, as somebody who’s trained to be an assassin, you would be better at puzzle solving.

[01:21:18] James: You would think but how many times have we seen run headfirst into a dangerous trap situation because she was too impatient to look at it yeah she she has she has the incident well in Assassin’s Blade though you know and then she has well she actually has a number of incidents in Assassin’s Blade in the different stories And she didn’t learn from a damn one of them and then, you know, she’s got the whole thing where she gets in trouble [01:22:00] with, um, I don’t even remember what the other one was and then, you know, she goes right in and she’s like, I trust you Archer Finn and like

[01:22:12] Ka-Ce: Yeah,

[01:22:13] James: if she would just stop for 30 seconds, and critically think about what she’s doing, and what she’s attempting to do, then

[01:22:30] I think she would optimize so much of her effectiveness.

[01:22:35] Ka-Ce: I agree

[01:22:38] James: because, yes, she does this and, I just imagine her going up, and she’s like, places it. and then, Ahm, Ahm Ahm Ahm, Ahm Ahm, Ahm, ahm, ah, ah, ahm, ahm, Ya know. not working. It was like me when I was trying to fix my thing in the car today and it was like, it’s not working. Why isn’t it working? Damn it.

[01:22:56] Ka-Ce: Yes, but you get frustrated, then you take a moment, and you research some more, then you come back to it. I feel like Celaena doesn’t do that

[01:23:03] James: Yeah, that’s exactly what she should do. I understand because I get upset when I look at a thing and I go, it needs to work this way because of, you know, how this works and then it doesn’t. And I go, Oh, and then I get mad and then I come back and I look at it and I go, okay.

[01:23:20] Let me try this thing. And then it usually works and it’s like, okay, I just needed to stop, review, and Come back.

[01:23:32] Ka-Ce: Yea

[01:23:32] James: And yea, she doesn’t do that. She gets mad and then she leaves.

[01:23:37] Ka-Ce: Yea. Celaena, Celaena. You got some growin’ to do, girl. But then you know, if she didn’t rush off and be a hot head, and all this, then she would be too perfect as FMC, and then we would get irritated with that.

[01:23:54] James: Seriously. I don’t think she’s at any risk right now of being too perfect. No. [01:24:00] no, she’s got that going for her that, uh, you know, almost irritatingly to the other side where she screws up so often.

[01:24:13] Ka-Ce: She’s too human

[01:24:17] James: too impulsive.

[01:24:19] Ka-Ce: Mmm. I’ve known a couple of people that are like that though, so, will see how this develops. We also have seen, time and time again, this white stag, um, you know, it’s a symbol of Terrasen, it keeps coming to Celaena in her dreams, um, and apparently it showed itself to her, you know, when she was being led away to the prison.

[01:24:47] And I did a little bit of digging because, you know, when we were wedding shopping years and years ago and you were getting fitted for your kilt and everything, a lot of, um, the pins and stuff in Scottish culture are like the stag. And we keep seeing the stag reference. So A white stag does bear symbolism and meaning in many, like, European countries as well as, you know, some spiritual meanings. Um, and it can mean, like, the white coat of the stag can mean purity or innocence. But also the stag’s appearance can mean that there is going to be a quest or a great change. And in a lot of Celtic mythologies, the white stag is considered to be a messenger from the other world.

[01:25:40] James: Hmm.

[01:25:41] Ka-Ce: So, do you think that this, that Sarah was drawing from this, do you think the white stag in this world can mean that Celaena is going on a quest, or is about to be involved in great change, or maybe [01:26:00] the white stag is a messenger from the other world, like Elena?

[01:26:06] James: I mean, the fact that she… the fact that this is the stag that, you know, she saw when she was being carted off to Endovier. And it is something that has revealed itself to her multiple times. It does seem sort of like it’s a messenger of change. Something’s gonna happen, but also kinda like, something is gonna happen. But just know that, that something is, like, watching, keeping an eye on you, maybe?

[01:26:45] Like, it’s gonna be a change.

[01:26:49] But you’re going to be okay because, you know, whatever unknown, you know, reason.

[01:26:58] Ka-Ce: Yea.

[01:27:01] James: It does definitely feel like it reveals itself to her when there is like a major or if she needs like, uh, what’s the, like she needs reassurance. Yeah. Um, Because, you know, the last time she saw it, well, actually pretty much every time she sees it, something really bad happens.

[01:27:25] Ka-Ce: Yea, and she needs that glimmer of hope or something to hold to.

[01:27:32] James: Yea, which makes you wonder what is going to be really bad,

[01:27:38] what’s going to happen now if she’s seeing it again, right? Because, um

[01:27:42] Ka-Ce: Yup

[01:27:43] James: Uh, dun, dun, dun

[01:27:45] Ka-Ce: Yes.

[01:27:47] With that dun, dun, dun, we head into Chapter 21. Chaol took his morning run alone. He should have known, should have remembered, that today was the death of her parents. In her battle [01:28:00] with Cain, he remembered her screaming while taunted her about the brutal murder of her parents. Nehemia informed him that she wouldn’t return after nightfall, that she wouldn’t want to spend today of all days in Rifthold, let alone the castle. Chaol wondered what secrets Nehemia held that the king wanted her watched, and who had actually threatened Nehemia’s life? It is a little suspicious that the king hasn’t told Chaol, who is captain of the guard, who actually threatened Nehemia. This day, last year, Celaena had awoken from the dream of the stag in the ravine feeling a cold, hopeless rage that took hold of her. That was the day she had unleashed herself at Endovier. She killed the overseer with her pickaxe. Two guards at the end of the tunnel in the mine were dead before they even knew what happened. Then she made her way to the chamber where there were four overseers. The ones who had taken the woman from Eyllwe when she first arrived.

[01:28:59] The ones who had raped and killed this woman. All four men died too quickly from her axe. More guards died. But no slaves cheered. And then soon, Celaena was running, sprinting for death, making her way towards the towering stone wall. Arrow shot at her and she zigzagged. The king had ordered that she not be killed, but she was trying her damnedest, hoping that if she killed enough guards that they would forget the king’s order and would kill her. Celaena laughed when she reached the wall and was surrounded by 40 guards. Laughed when she lashed out one last time. Laughed even as her world went dark. Chaol waited for Celaena in her room. She arrived after midnight and wordlessly got ready for bed. Celaena informs Chaol that she doesn’t want company. And Chaol tells her that want and need are different things.

[01:29:58] Nehemia probably should have been there for [01:30:00] Celaena, but Chaol wanted to be the one to be there for her. It was then that Celaena noticed the chocolate cake that Chaol brought her. They held each other tight before Celaena told him, quote, I can’t tell if I should be ashamed of wanting to hold you on this day, or grateful that, despite what happened before now, it somehow brought me to you. Chaol didn’t know how to respond to that, but Celaena didn’t give him a chance to reply, and she strode to the chocolate cake and dug in.

[01:30:32] James: I love that she’s like, Thank you for being here. Now I want cake.

[01:30:39] Ka-Ce: Girl has her priorities. I mean, if you were to present me with a big chocolate cake when I’m having a bad day. That, that’s exactly where I’m gonna be going towards. I, for one, am actually surprised that Dorian hadn’t pieced any of this together about what day it was for Celaena. And that he wasn’t the one to talk to Chaol or Nehemia.

[01:31:07] In Throne of Glass, we saw Dorian being so in tuned with Celaena, especially with things like this. He was just so in tuned to Celaena’s emotions and needs and everything. And I get that he has finally pulled back, realizing that he doesn’t have a future with her and he needs to let her go. Um, you know, and he’s also a bit distracted with the cold, swirling awakening that’s him.

[01:31:33] James: He’s got a lot going on too, yeah.

[01:31:35] Ka-Ce: Yes, yes he does. I just, I still feel like he probably, just given his nature and who he is, that he would have been like, hey Nehemia or hey Chaol, can you check up on her today? I think today is gonna be an emotionally packed day. And instead, it was Chaol and Nehemia who were like, [01:32:00] more in tuned to what this was.

[01:32:03] Um,

[01:32:04] James: I mean, even Chaol didn’t really remember. It was

[01:32:09] Ka-Ce: Nehemia, and she had a letter. I mean, he may also piece together bits and things that what she’s learned from

[01:32:16] James: I suppose that Chaol would have, would have figured it out if he had seen the letter.

[01:32:23] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[01:32:24] James: Um, it’s just that Nehemia had gotten there first, so, I suppose. But yeah, I mean, Dorian went through all this stuff about, you know, trying to be,

[01:32:36] you know, can we be friends, be, you know, good friends, da da da, and then now he’s acting like, I’m just, I’m done with you, I can’t, I can’t think of you, I can’t look at you, because it’s so hard. You know, I don’t know. He’s just, he’s still being whiny, even though he, this is, this is like twice now that he’s decided to give up on her. Right. Because the first time when he was, he, okay. The first time was when he was hunting and the stag showed up and he was, then he was like, I get it. Like, I’m the prince, dah, dah, dah, dah.

[01:33:19] But then. Now, he’s like, oh, Chaol and Celaena are dancing. I guess it really is, like, not going to be a thing. It’s like, dude, how many times are you going to have this talk with yourself about letting her go? You were supposed to already be past this?

[01:33:39] Ka-Ce: Yeah. I mean, it’s been, what, two, three months at this point? That’s hard. But I also feel like they weren’t together for very long. So, it shouldn’t be this hard of a breakup?

[01:33:57] James: Um,

[01:33:58] Ka-Ce: I don’t know. It’s [01:34:00] been so long since I’ve been on the dating scene. And that young. It’s been so long since I’ve been that young.

[01:34:08] James: um, yeah, unless he is just so Um, wigged out by this whole like magic thing that he’s just completely elsewhere. And I can see that where it’s just like, Oh shit. Oh shit. What the What the hell?

[01:34:33] Ka-Ce: especially considering who his father is and, you know, all the steps that the king has done to eradicate magic and then come to find out that you might have magic or magic something in you that’s

[01:34:51] James: Yeah, exactly

[01:34:51] Ka-Ce: automatic death sentence, like, what the fuck? It was also nice that Celaena Took the day off, took the space she needed to grieve.

[01:35:02] I feel like she’s been through the ringer. You know, her time with Sam was cut short, and it, it, ever since then it was just like one thing after another. The betrayal, Sam’s death, imprisonment, the mines, the championship, everything associated with the championship. She has just not had time to breathe or grieve.

[01:35:24] Um, and all of that resting on an 18 year old’s shoulders. Like I can barely handle my own mental challenges and daily challenges.

[01:35:34] James: well, I mean, that’s what we were talking about last time was yeah. She literally hasn’t had a break. Right? She’s gone through all of this stuff from the, from the death of Sam getting caught, Endovier, getting brought out, getting threatened, doing the championship, demons. And after all of that, now hiding assassinations from the king because she’s still [01:36:00] Trying to be a good person, and then she has Nehemia basically riding her ass about saving her people, and then Dorian being a whiny bitch because she broke up with him.

[01:36:13] You know, yeah, she has not had, and so now she’s got this one day, and it’s a messed up day, but it’s one day she can go and be by herself, and Chaol and Nehemia are like, Okay, we don’t need to hunt you down today, you just go do your thing and we’ll be here when you get back.

[01:36:39] Ka-Ce: yep.

[01:36:41] James: She needs more than a day,

[01:36:43] Ka-Ce: Yes, yes she does. I’m

[01:36:46] James: least she got the day.

[01:36:48] day

[01:36:48] Ka-Ce: I am a little surprised that like, Chaol didn’t set out to go find her to like, keep her company or something. But I’m also glad that he respected her wishes and stayed away and he did, you know, stay in her room waiting for her return and he thought chocolate cake, that’s what she’s gonna need.

[01:37:10] James: Can’t go wrong with chocolate cake.

[01:37:12] Ka-Ce: No. But just hold on to that thought while you are reading Onyx Storm.

[01:37:22] James: Is Violet a fan of chocolate cake?

[01:37:27] Ka-Ce: Oh, you’re going to have a fun time with it

[01:37:28] James: She hasn’t really talked about it. So, uh,

[01:37:32] Ka-Ce: Oh, you’re going to have a fun time with it. That’s all I’ll say. Uh

[01:37:38] James: so, are we thinking that Chaol, is Chaol starting to, um, question Nehemia? Because he did see her studying with a book with weird marks in it, and they looked familiar. he knows that there is something [01:38:00] more going on, because the king’s not telling him everything. And the king won’t even tell him who the threat is coming from. Which is kind of weird,

[01:38:09] Ka-Ce: Yes.

[01:38:10] James: Cuz, you’d, you’d think that he should know.

[01:38:13] Like, oh it was, you know, this group of People over here and Chaol could be like, Oh, I’m a watch those guys, you know, but it’s, it said he’s got some random, like, and does the King know where the threat came from? Did it come in a letter? Did it come, did he make it up? You know, like, where is the legitimacy of this threat?

[01:38:40] Right. And I know we’re not there yet. And, you know, I’ll have to remember to talk about it when we get to later, um, about how he handles this. But I’m having a hard time blaming him for not telling anybody about the threat because it just feels fishy.

[01:39:03] Ka-Ce: It’s fishy and it’s vague.

[01:39:06] James: Like it feels like a not real thing.

[01:39:10] Ka-Ce: I feel like if it was a real thing, the king would have been like, you need to watch out for this Lord or this group of people or, you know, whoever this threat came from, because as captain of the guard, he would need to know that thing. So he could prepare for that. And he could set up measures to protect her from that.

[01:39:30] But the king’s not giving him anything, other than just watch her discreetly. We’re gonna need to send her back home soon.

[01:39:38] James: Yeah, I mean.

[01:39:39] Ka-Ce: That’s not a lot of information.

[01:39:40] James: Unless the king just honestly is like, yeah, she got a death threat. And you know, if she dies, I don’t really give a shit, you know? But at the same time, then you would think that Chaol would have been like, is there any more information I should know about this? Or is everyone just so afraid to question the [01:40:00] king?

[01:40:00] They’re like, whatever you tell me, cool. I will work with that.

[01:40:04] Ka-Ce: I mean, there is that. also this blind loyalty that Chaol has, you know, like, that he has to stay loyal to the king, he has to stay loyal to Dorian, and not question. And, that’s problematic in and of itself.

[01:40:20] James: This is something that we will see with all of the characters. They all need to learn that asking questions helps you do your job better.

[01:40:34] Ka-Ce: It also just helps as a person.

[01:40:37] James: Ask the question. The worst the person can do is say, You don’t need to know. Okay, at least I asked the question.

[01:40:47] Ka-Ce: Yeah.

[01:40:49] James: But none of them ask the questions when asking questions is important.

[01:40:56] Ka-Ce: And then we wouldn’t have a story.

[01:40:58] James: Get it together, guys. Come on.

[01:41:03] Oh my goodness.

[01:41:05] Ka-Ce: Yea

[01:41:08] James: uh, yeah.

[01:41:11] I don’t know. It just, it, yeah. It just feels like there’s something

[01:41:19] Ka-Ce: Something there

[01:41:20] James: There’s something. And whether it’s the king withholding information, or if it’s just If there is no information, it’s just, yeah. I would have a hard time with that too, I think. So.

[01:41:40] On that note, that brings us to the end of tonight’s Crown of Midnight discussion. The next, uh, what am I looking at? The next, the, not the next, [01:42:00] next Tuesday! Good lord, okay. Next Tuesday, for Crowd of Midnight, we will be doing chapters 22 through 28. So, if you have not already read the book, try and get up to at least that point. Um, on Thursday, Instead of doing our, uh, Fourth Wing episode, we will have our, uh, our recap of the Romantasy, uh, BookCon convention that we went to a couple weekends ago.

[01:42:53] And then, starting again up the next week, we’ll get back into Fourth Wing. But if you would like to, uh, If you’d like to visit that, we have, um, three episodes up already of Fourth Wing. So you can get started and get going as we progress through multiple things that we are doing. We’re just running all over the place.

[01:43:18] We got in betweens and we got, um, you know, book reviews and all kinds of stuff we’re trying to put together for you guys. So,

[01:43:27] thank you so much for joining us again this week, and we hope that you got some entertainment and you were able to maybe learn something new in Throne of Glass or just enjoy reliving the universe. Maybe it got you thinking about something that you missed or Maybe you just, yeah, maybe you learned something new.

[01:43:46] Who knows? If you have any thoughts, theories, or ideas, let us know in the comments. Or you can email us at hello@bookscatsandchaos.com Or you can comment on our YouTube [01:44:00] or any of our other social media channels.

[01:44:04] Ka-Ce: Yep. Please remember to like, subscribe, and comment. Your ratings and likes do really mean the world to us. And if you like what you hear so far, please share with your friends, families, neighbors, babysitters, you know,

[01:44:17] James: Cats, dogs, lizard, gerbil,

[01:44:20] Ka-Ce: Yep, just put us on while you go out and let, your, let your fur babies listen to us. You can also check us out on TikTok, threads, Instagram, Facebook. We try to be active everywhere we can. As we head out, please don’t forget to give some. Big love to our friends over at K911 ResQ. That is K 9 1 1 R E S Q.

[01:44:44] And they do such important work, you know, trying to help as many animals that are, you know, not usually the cute cuddly ones that everybody goes for. They tend to focus on the senior and the handicapped. The ones that really need the special attention and care and love. So please head over. They are very active on social media.

[01:45:04] They have a website. They They rely on, you know, all of us on volunteers and fosters and everyone. So go give them some love. They are wonderful, wonderful people who do absolutely wonderful work. And we will drop their link in our show notes below.

[01:45:24] James: Alright, sounds good. So we will see you guys next time.

[01:45:30] Ka-Ce: Happy reading!